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Matthew The Wise
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 Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 11:17 am Post subject: |
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| BC Wakeboarder wrote: |
Global Warming is Here. Scientists say we are to late to stop it but we can still slow it down. this will be the death of many of us. if not all. Though this would take many generations and our children's.children's.children's.children's. will be facing that fate. Because of what we failed to realize we needed to change our lifestyles dramaticly in time. :cry: .
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BC your absolutely right! Im in College to get Diplomas in Environmental Sciences and our fate is iminent (Spelt wrong i think) and not only do we have to deal with Global Warming we also have a new (but not so new) Threat! Its called Global Dimming! Not many people know about this outside of the scientific community. Global Dimming infact slows the effects of Global Warming. and Global Dimming is a major cause of starvation, and one question thats being asked is if we remove global Dimming or slow it down .... will Global Warming become much worse?
Our Generations will feel the effects of both of these Monsters sooner then most think.
I suggest that anyone that is interested should check out this link!
http://www.documentary-film.net/search/sample.php
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BC Wakeboarder
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Joined: 26 Apr 2007
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Location: Kamloops BC
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 6:32 am Post subject: |
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Great Post Matthew. Until I seen that documentry on Global Dimming I did not know anything about it. It seems that Global Dimming has already been deadly killing millions of people due to a long drought. And in Europe they tried using better exhaust and a few years later people died by the thousands from the hot weather they were getting.
We need to slow them both down. But as many scientsts say it is to late to stop Global warming. I don't think Global Warming could ever be stoped but it could have been slowed down so much that we wouldn't need to worry about it for millions of years or more. Global Warming is Natural thats life. :wink: |
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Matthew The Wise
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 11:21 am Post subject: |
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To put it in laymans terms its simply the next natural "Ice Age" of the earths cycles.
But the fact is that the human race has only sped it up, so that it occurs faster and with more damage in less time.
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I forget what im told, I remember what i see, i Understand what i do!
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queen
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
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Location: somewhere in Chiefs Country
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2007 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Matthew The Wise wrote: | To put it in laymans terms its simply the next natural "Ice Age" of the earths cycles.
But the fact is that the human race has only sped it up, so that it occurs faster and with more damage in less time. |
I have an article on this from my football site....I'll move it in as soon as I can......
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queen
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| Posted: Tue May 15, 2007 8:34 am Post subject: |
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| queen wrote: | | Matthew The Wise wrote: | To put it in laymans terms its simply the next natural "Ice Age" of the earths cycles.
But the fact is that the human race has only sped it up, so that it occurs faster and with more damage in less time. |
I have an article on this from my football site....I'll move it in as soon as I can...... |
Junk Science: Can’t See the Warming for the Trees
If you need further evidence that hysteria is outpacing science in the global warming debate, consider the study published this week about Northern Hemisphere forests actually causing significant global warming.
Researchers from the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory reported in the "Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences" (April 17) that while tropical forests exert a cooling influence on global climate, forests in northern regions exert a warming influence — and it’s not just a trivial climatic effect.
Based on the researchers’ computer modeling, forests above 20 degrees latitude in the Northern Hemisphere — that is, north of the line of latitude running through Southern Mexico, Saharan Africa, central India and the southernmost Chinese island of Hainan — will warm surface temperatures in those regions by an estimated 10 degrees Fahrenheit by the year 2100.
Most of the warming is predicted to occur north of 50 degrees latitude — that is, north of the line of latitude running just north of the U.S. border with Canada, through Northern France, Northern Mongolia and Southern Siberia.
As the researchers explained in their media release, forests affect climate in three different ways: they absorb carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and evaporate water to the atmosphere (which increases cloudiness), both of which cool the planet.
Forests are dark and absorb sunlight (the “albedo” effect), warming the planet. In tropical forests, the net effect of these phenomena is cooling, while in Northern forests, the net effect is warming.
Although the media has largely ignored the study, it should give us plenty to think about.
First, it’s a stunning reminder that we still have a very steep learning curve when it comes to climate and how nature and man may impact it. In addition to this study, just over a year ago scientists discovered that plants emit as much as 30 percent of the annual global production of methane, the third most important greenhouse gas after water vapor and carbon dioxide.
Last fall, we learned that 5 years of cosmic ray activity could cause as much warming as 200 years of human greenhouse gas emissions.
It’s no wonder that alarmists want — and need — us to rush to judgment about manmade global warming before scientific discoveries dismantle their shaky polemic.
Next, the United Nations projects that global temperatures may rise anywhere from 2.5 to 10.4 degrees Fahrenheit by 2100. So exactly how does the 10-degree warming caused by Northern forests fit into the picture? Could Northern forests be a (the) major contributor to the supposed problem of global warming?
Then there are the eco-activist groups that have been spreading misinformation about Northern forests in their campaign against businesses that manufacture or sell products made from timber harvested from subarctic, or Boreal, forests.
ForestEthics, for example, claims that “Because the Boreal holds more carbon than any other terrestrial landscape, its conservation is imperative. Degrading the Boreal landscape threatens to transform the Boreal from one of the few healthy ‘lungs of the planet’ into a net climate destabilizer.”
Just last month, ForestEthics issued a report, “Robbing the Carbon Bank: Global Warming and Ontario’s Boreal Forest,” that alleged, “The logging of intact forests is one of Canada’s least recognized drivers of global warming.”
Having completely overlooked the albedo effect in its report, ForestEthics seems to have the net climate effect of Boreal forests exactly wrong. But this hasn’t stopped it from successfully attacking a variety of businesses for selling products made from Northern timber.
ForestEthics has browbeaten a long list of brand-conscious companies into commitments not to use timber from Northern forests including Apple Computer, Dell Computer, Federal Express, Hewlett-Packard, Home Depot, IKEA, Johnson & Johnson, Kinko’s, Lowe’s, Nike, Office Depot, Staples, Starbucks and many others.
ForestEthics’ most recent success came last December at the expense of Limited Brands, which was targeted with the group’s “Victoria’s Dirty Secret” campaign (Victoria Secret’s catalogues used paper made from Northern timber).
After caving in to ForestEthics, the Limited Brand’s Tom Katzemeyer said, “We’re hoping to raise the bar on the availability of environmentally friendly paper and pulp. …”
But how will Limited Brands’ “hope” ever overcome the Boreal’s albedo effect? If global warming is the dreaded catastrophe advertised by the enviros, then Northern forests hardly seem all that eco-friendly insofar as they may cause 10 degrees Fahrenheit of warming by 2100.
Finally, let’s not overlook the scam factor.
For years, global warming opportunists (aka “climateers”) urged consumers to compensate for their so-called “carbon footprints” by paying to plant trees. But as the facts slowly emerged about reforestation, the carbon-offset industry quietly backed off planting trees and moved on to other offset schemes.
One carbon-offset vendor, The Carbon Neutral Co., says on its Web site, “In those early days, the icon of a tree and its emotional appeal were critical to attract audiences. But, thankfully, the market has grown in sophistication — markedly over the last 4 years, and such obvious symbols are less necessary.”
Translation? Perhaps, “the facts have caught up with us and so we’ve changed shell games”?
Science is slowly, but similarly catching up with global warming alarmism. The only question is how the race will be won — with facts or fear?
Steven Milloy publishes JunkScience.com and CSRWatch.com. He is a junk science expert, and advocate of free enterprise and an adjunct scholar at the Competitive Enterprise Institute.
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queen
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Posts: 3065
Location: somewhere in Chiefs Country
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| Posted: Tue May 15, 2007 8:37 am Post subject: |
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| queen wrote: | | Matthew The Wise wrote: | To put it in laymans terms its simply the next natural "Ice Age" of the earths cycles.
But the fact is that the human race has only sped it up, so that it occurs faster and with more damage in less time. |
I have an article on this from my football site....I'll move it in as soon as I can...... |
Junk Science: Can’t See the Warming for the Trees
If you need further evidence that hysteria is outpacing science in the global warming debate, consider the study published this week about Northern Hemisphere forests actually causing significant global warming.
Researchers from the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory reported in the "Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences" (April 17) that while tropical forests exert a cooling influence on global climate, forests in northern regions exert a warming influence — and it’s not just a trivial climatic effect.
Based on the researchers’ computer modeling, forests above 20 degrees latitude in the Northern Hemisphere — that is, north of the line of latitude running through Southern Mexico, Saharan Africa, central India and the southernmost Chinese island of Hainan — will warm surface temperatures in those regions by an estimated 10 degrees Fahrenheit by the year 2100.
Most of the warming is predicted to occur north of 50 degrees latitude — that is, north of the line of latitude running just north of the U.S. border with Canada, through Northern France, Northern Mongolia and Southern Siberia.
As the researchers explained in their media release, forests affect climate in three different ways: they absorb carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and evaporate water to the atmosphere (which increases cloudiness), both of which cool the planet.
Forests are dark and absorb sunlight (the “albedo” effect), warming the planet. In tropical forests, the net effect of these phenomena is cooling, while in Northern forests, the net effect is warming.
Although the media has largely ignored the study, it should give us plenty to think about.
First, it’s a stunning reminder that we still have a very steep learning curve when it comes to climate and how nature and man may impact it. In addition to this study, just over a year ago scientists discovered that plants emit as much as 30 percent of the annual global production of methane, the third most important greenhouse gas after water vapor and carbon dioxide.
Last fall, we learned that 5 years of cosmic ray activity could cause as much warming as 200 years of human greenhouse gas emissions.
It’s no wonder that alarmists want — and need — us to rush to judgment about manmade global warming before scientific discoveries dismantle their shaky polemic.
Next, the United Nations projects that global temperatures may rise anywhere from 2.5 to 10.4 degrees Fahrenheit by 2100. So exactly how does the 10-degree warming caused by Northern forests fit into the picture? Could Northern forests be a (the) major contributor to the supposed problem of global warming?
Then there are the eco-activist groups that have been spreading misinformation about Northern forests in their campaign against businesses that manufacture or sell products made from timber harvested from subarctic, or Boreal, forests.
ForestEthics, for example, claims that “Because the Boreal holds more carbon than any other terrestrial landscape, its conservation is imperative. Degrading the Boreal landscape threatens to transform the Boreal from one of the few healthy ‘lungs of the planet’ into a net climate destabilizer.”
Just last month, ForestEthics issued a report, “Robbing the Carbon Bank: Global Warming and Ontario’s Boreal Forest,” that alleged, “The logging of intact forests is one of Canada’s least recognized drivers of global warming.”
Having completely overlooked the albedo effect in its report, ForestEthics seems to have the net climate effect of Boreal forests exactly wrong. But this hasn’t stopped it from successfully attacking a variety of businesses for selling products made from Northern timber.
ForestEthics has browbeaten a long list of brand-conscious companies into commitments not to use timber from Northern forests including Apple Computer, Dell Computer, Federal Express, Hewlett-Packard, Home Depot, IKEA, Johnson & Johnson, Kinko’s, Lowe’s, Nike, Office Depot, Staples, Starbucks and many others.
ForestEthics’ most recent success came last December at the expense of Limited Brands, which was targeted with the group’s “Victoria’s Dirty Secret” campaign (Victoria Secret’s catalogues used paper made from Northern timber).
After caving in to ForestEthics, the Limited Brand’s Tom Katzemeyer said, “We’re hoping to raise the bar on the availability of environmentally friendly paper and pulp. …”
But how will Limited Brands’ “hope” ever overcome the Boreal’s albedo effect? If global warming is the dreaded catastrophe advertised by the enviros, then Northern forests hardly seem all that eco-friendly insofar as they may cause 10 degrees Fahrenheit of warming by 2100.
Finally, let’s not overlook the scam factor.
For years, global warming opportunists (aka “climateers”) urged consumers to compensate for their so-called “carbon footprints” by paying to plant trees. But as the facts slowly emerged about reforestation, the carbon-offset industry quietly backed off planting trees and moved on to other offset schemes.
One carbon-offset vendor, The Carbon Neutral Co., says on its Web site, “In those early days, the icon of a tree and its emotional appeal were critical to attract audiences. But, thankfully, the market has grown in sophistication — markedly over the last 4 years, and such obvious symbols are less necessary.”
Translation? Perhaps, “the facts have caught up with us and so we’ve changed shell games”?
Science is slowly, but similarly catching up with global warming alarmism. The only question is how the race will be won — with facts or fear?
Steven Milloy publishes JunkScience.com and CSRWatch.com. He is a junk science expert, and advocate of free enterprise and an adjunct scholar at the Competitive Enterprise Institute.
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Lord Clarke
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Joined: 16 Jul 2007
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Location: South of the North Pole
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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| swift wrote: | u all realize that we just want oil over there?
its not really that we were searching for nucs. I mean we did feel a lil threatened that any one else sides us would get any power at all but we just wanted oil!!! Were even putting extra resources aside to protect oil tankers... That arent ours!!! thats pretty messed up if u think bout it |
You do realize that we did go for WMDs, and that all of our politicians believed the intelligence that said Saddam had the weapons, dating back to the late 90s, when both Clintons, Al Gore, Kerry, Kennedy, and just about everybody else that was "in the know" is quoted as saying so....but if you want to make believe that this war was not about security, keep fooling yourselves.
No, Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, but in the summer before the buildup to the Iraq war President Putin, Russia for those of you who do not know, is quoted at the Annual Asian Leaders conference as saying the Russian intelligence has conclusive evidence that the Iraqi's were planning a 9/11 type of attack on U.S. soil, probably in New York, on their own, for fall of 2001, but of course Osama Bin Laden beat them too it. But your liberal media suppressed this information to little more than a 2 line blurb on page 27 of your local newspaper. Furthermore, we have all seen tapes of Iraqi intelligence meeting with Al Quaida representatives pre 9/11 to discuss attacking the U.S., however it appears that philosophical differences did not allow them to go any further than talks. But this shows a desire by the Iraqis to hit us, and as Bush said on 9/13/01, we will no longer wait to be attacked and react, but seek out those seeking to harm us. You all stood up and cheered at that during that speech, as did I. I guess you people in your cushy homes protected by our military and intelligence community have forgotten how horrible we felt in the hours and days after 9/11. I haven't forgotten the smoke billowing over NYC. I will not forget. So if there were no WMDs in Iraq, so what, Saddam was trying and that is good enough for me. And besides, we have intelligence photos showing convoys of trucks "appearing" in the middle of the frickin dessert in Iraq and driving straight for the borders of Syria in the months leading up to the war, which Iraq knew was coming. These convoys were never there before, or since. From the middle of nowhere in the dessert. Could these have been the mobile labs and the WMDs that we heard about so much pre-war? Could it be that the international community stalled long enough to allow them to be transported safely to Syria?
I don't know, and neither do you.
But I say god bless and thank you to the President that has protected my family to the detriment of his "popularity".
Grow up and look around. The world hated us before the Iraq War, they will hate us after it. But when times of strife come around, when one group is slaughtering the other, when disease and famine come around, when earthquakes and tsunami's hit, they are going to come back to us, not asking, but demanding our help. The last time we ignored them, 75% of Europe was conquered. Yet they forget. We are their saviours, and they will always hate us for it. Its called jealousy.
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Lord Clarke
football friend
Joined: 16 Jul 2007
Posts: 400
Location: South of the North Pole
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Matthew The Wise wrote: | | BC Wakeboarder wrote: |
Global Warming is Here. Scientists say we are to late to stop it but we can still slow it down. this will be the death of many of us. if not all. Though this would take many generations and our children's.children's.children's.children's. will be facing that fate. Because of what we failed to realize we needed to change our lifestyles dramaticly in time. :cry: .
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BC your absolutely right! Im in College to get Diplomas in Environmental Sciences and our fate is iminent (Spelt wrong i think) and not only do we have to deal with Global Warming we also have a new (but not so new) Threat! Its called Global Dimming! Not many people know about this outside of the scientific community. Global Dimming infact slows the effects of Global Warming. and Global Dimming is a major cause of starvation, and one question thats being asked is if we remove global Dimming or slow it down .... will Global Warming become much worse?
Our Generations will feel the effects of both of these Monsters sooner then most think.
I suggest that anyone that is interested should check out this link!
http://www.documentary-film.net/search/sample.php |
I suggest that, as an Environmental Engineer, in the field for over 15 years, that you ask your liberal professors for the whole truth. 25 years ago, when I was in junior high, they were telling us that we were in the midst of a global cool down, headed towards the ice age. Now we are in the midst of a global warming. What has changed?
The way they tweak the numbers for political gain.
The truth is, we don't know. Our climate has warmed and cooled several times in the past century. We have only measured weather for, what, about 150 years, and they really are not all inclusive and accurate for most of the world until the last 50 years? And yet we think we have enough information to predict all this doom and gloom? Global warming may very well be happening, but there is NO, ZERO, hard, inconclusive evidence that says man is at fault. I don't care what Michael Moore and Al Gore have cooked up, the fact is that both are sensationalists that refuse to debate real experts in the field, because their conclusions are based on nothing more than half truths and supposition and scare tactics.
The public has to be educated in the dangers of global warming, but also of the fact that we don't know all of the causes, or how big of an impact man has made on the climate. As one of the above articles states, it is possible that forrests cause more global warming than all of the cars and power plants in the western hemisphere. Well if thats the case, do we want to cut down all of the trees? No, preposterous. But if I was like Al Gore, and looked at only a piece of the puzzle, that is exactly what I would be proposing. Instead of trees given out on arbour day I would be asking schools to disburse chain saws and axes.
We need the whole truth, not the politicized sensationalism.
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Lord Clarke
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Joined: 16 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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2 other things that I forgot....one is the climate has had increasing temperatures and decreasing temperatures throughout history. That is proven by geology and fossils. 3 known ice ages, followed by global warming. Those are called facts. Our climate's temperatures have been rising since the last ice age, some 10,000 years ago. We don't know specific averages, however, scientists tell us that based on studies of plant fossils and animal fossils. More tropical vegetation moving north (in north hemisphere, south in south hemisphere), animals get smaller - smaller animals do better in warmer climates, which you can see by the size of the common deer in our country. In Florida, the key deer, about the size of a medium sized dog....in North Carolina, deer are about as big as a great dane, and in Pennsylvania, they can be twice that size....and these are common deer. I am sure there are aberrations, but that is the trend. Same with the common box turtle. Anyway, fossils show that animals have gotten smaller over the last 10,000 years, which is evidence of global warming. So how does a steady evolution happen over 10,000 years, yet the industrial age of man is only about 200 years old, yet the industrial age is the trigger to the global warming epidemic?
Also, secondly, if you are in school for "diplomas in envirnmental science" or spelled (by you) something like that, please, before you send out your first resume, or even before that, before you submit your first term paper, learn to use spell check....spelling does count in the real world. Your arguments would be better received and demand more respect if your spelling was accurate.....not being a smart ass, just a realist. Just some friendly advice.
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eo11
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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global warming is disputed by just as many smart scientist as claim it and it is all most likely a bunch of adue about nothing
we are not in IRAQ for oil but if we can protect some while we are there GREAT
one thing I can say with 100% sureity whatever your professor says that is not verbateum from the text book is a load of snake oil he is trying to sell you
make up your own minds do not be sheep to the liberal college professor whose biggest goal in life is to score with the sheepish chick (or boy) on the 3rd row
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Lord Clarke
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Joined: 16 Jul 2007
Posts: 400
Location: South of the North Pole
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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| eo11 wrote: | global warming is disputed by just as many smart scientist as claim it and it is all most likely a bunch of adue about nothing
we are not in IRAQ for oil but if we can protect some while we are there GREAT
one thing I can say with 100% sureity whatever your professor says that is not verbateum from the text book is a load of snake oil he is trying to sell you
make up your own minds do not be sheep to the liberal college professor whose biggest goal in life is to score with the sheepish chick (or boy) on the 3rd row |
Amen Brother!!!!
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eo11
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Location: earth
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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this probably belongs elsewhere but
There is no such thing as global warming. AJ Hawk was cold, so he turned the sun up.
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queen
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Location: somewhere in Chiefs Country
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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ohhhhhhhhhhhh brother.......
Did I tell you all he was a Green Bay fan???
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Lord Clarke
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Location: South of the North Pole
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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| eo11 wrote: | this probably belongs elsewhere but
There is no such thing as global warming. AJ Hawk was cold, so he turned the sun up. |
I liked the post somebody had about this "new thing that nobody knows about yet".....Global Dimming....now, I must admit, I had never heard that term before, or never researched it, but I looked it up after seeing the post, because something was familiar to it.....when I was in 8th grade, in conservation class, back in 1983 or 84, it was called the Green House Affect (should that be effect or affect? I can never remember)....and it was why we were heading to the next Ice Age......its funny how they recycle old theories, give them brand new, shiny names, and parade them out as something new.
This "new" theory son that you are talking about is why refrigerators and air conditioners no longer have real freon to keep your car and house and beer cold....the good stuff is no longer allowed to be produced in this country for this theory, and its at least a quarter century old. The only thing new is the name. And that is also why hair sprays have changed drastically over the years, and the promotion of them on tv.
And funny thing, in 5 years, when Global Dimming is the rage.....Al Gore will have invented or discovered that too.
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